Sponsored

Elon Musk says that Lucid and Rivian are tracking toward bankruptcy

Spiffster

Well-Known Member
First Name
Jeremy
Joined
May 24, 2021
Threads
1
Messages
88
Reaction score
213
Location
Denver, CO
Vehicles
Tesla Model 3 (Sold), Ford Fusion Energi
Elon, dude, you really gonna be the one to spread FUD like that? Considering where he came from this sort of commentary is rich af. Lots of us are former Tesla owners, and I imagine a lot of us feel like we upgraded... definitely in terms of (build) quality and definitely in term of capability.

Shit... even the CEO is a massive upgrade. Maybe go back to shilling DOGE, pal.
Sponsored

 
Last edited:

Scoiatael

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 20, 2021
Threads
35
Messages
923
Reaction score
1,496
Location
Southern CA
Vehicles
F150 Lightning
I think the infotainment and lack of physical controls has the potential to kill Rivian unless something changes. There are a lot of people that don't like change, and if you want to succeed long-term, you can't just go after the tech-savvy people as that's really limiting your market. There are a lot of us that just want a no-nonsense vehicle that simply works without all the gadgetry.
Tesla seems to be doing fine without many physical controls.
 

SANZC02

Well-Known Member
First Name
Bob
Joined
Feb 11, 2021
Threads
29
Messages
5,260
Reaction score
8,863
Location
California
Vehicles
Tesla Model S, LE - R1S
Occupation
Retired
I think the infotainment and lack of physical controls has the potential to kill Rivian unless something changes. There are a lot of people that don't like change, and if you want to succeed long-term, you can't just go after the tech-savvy people as that's really limiting your market. There are a lot of us that just want a no-nonsense vehicle that simply works without all the gadgetry.
If that was a valid case Tesla would not be selling any cars.
 

COdogman

Well-Known Member
First Name
Brian
Joined
Jan 21, 2022
Threads
29
Messages
7,423
Reaction score
19,907
Location
Colorado
Vehicles
2023 R1T
Occupation
Dog Wrangler
I could care less what the world's most famous $hitposter thinks about almost anything. Rivian still has some tough years in front of them to really prove they "made it", and they have definitely made a bunch of unforced errors along the way, but I really feel they tried their best to build a company that can last. They are not vaporware like Nikola, Canoo, or Fisker. They also have products that people actually want. Rivian has the IL factory and a pretty sweet deal for that GA factory as well. As long as they keep putting vehicles out and improving the service experience they will be ok.
 

CharonPDX

Well-Known Member
First Name
Charon
Joined
Jul 12, 2021
Threads
21
Messages
1,064
Reaction score
1,507
Location
Cascadia
Vehicles
R1T LE, Mach-E, Arcimoto FUV, Repl: F-250/Model S
Occupation
InfoSec Geek
Clubs
 
I remember when he was adamant that he was in favor of the entire industry going electric, even if Tesla went under as part of it. He used to speak highly of attempts to break into the EV market.

Now he's just a petty little man who only wants personal power.
 

Sponsored

Zoidz

Well-Known Member
First Name
Gil
Joined
Feb 28, 2021
Threads
105
Messages
3,126
Reaction score
6,875
Location
PA
Vehicles
23 R1S Adv, Avalanche, BMWs-X3,330cic,K1200RS bike
Occupation
Engineer
From a guy that bought Twitter at a ridiculously high price, and seriously impacted Tesla stock. :rolleyes:
 

SASSquatch

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 3, 2022
Threads
34
Messages
1,834
Reaction score
3,562
Location
Washington DC
Vehicles
BMW i3s Ford C-Max Hybrid
Occupation
Semi-Autonomous Yeti
Clubs
 
Look - I'm not a fanboy of Elon Musk either, but I will say this: The Munroe teardown of the Instrument Panel (IP) had me concerned.

As a buyer, I was thrilled that those guys really thought highly of it overall.

As a shareholder, I was terrified that the experts on cost savings couldn't figure out how RIVIAN is making money on the R1T given the high quality and cost of materials.

Material and labor costs aren't going down anytime soon. So either, they embark on cost-saving measures by changing the design, they reach much better economies of scale in production, or they raise prices.

My bet is they continue to raise prices. But they have to do something...
 

Sully151

Well-Known Member
First Name
Chris
Joined
Jul 24, 2020
Threads
17
Messages
465
Reaction score
1,203
Location
Santa Margarita
Vehicles
2008 Jeep JkU
Occupation
Theater arts
He will really lose it when the R2’s come out as even more direct competition.
 

Sponsored

SASSquatch

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 3, 2022
Threads
34
Messages
1,834
Reaction score
3,562
Location
Washington DC
Vehicles
BMW i3s Ford C-Max Hybrid
Occupation
Semi-Autonomous Yeti
Clubs
 
He will really lose it when the R2’s come out as even more direct competition.
Again - I hate to be that guy, but no he won't. The R2 isn't going to be in mass production for years. TESLA has a massive, and I mean massive advantage over any other manufacturer when it comes to both EV and EV battery production across Texas/California/China/Germany.

Tesla has, is, and will continue to refine and cheapen their production costs to save money and they have economies of scale.

Because they have the only ubiquitous, reliable, and user friendly charging network, people will flock to TESLA because of that network even if their roofs and body panels keep blowing off on the way home from the damn delivery center.

RIVIAN does not have the economies of scale, network, or cost savings that TESLA has and probably never will. They are aiming at a very different market - a luxury lifestyle market. They have to stay focused on quality and utility and getting their margins to a place where they can be profitable.

That isn't going to happen for many years.

That said, I don't believe that they will go bankrupt because they have Amazon and Bezos has deep pockets. He sees RIVIAN as his counterweight to Musk in the EV market and he already has sunk costs in RIVIAN.
 

crashmtb

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 11, 2021
Threads
0
Messages
4,642
Reaction score
7,117
Location
Man oh Manitoba
Vehicles
2002 aluminium garden shed TD5
I think the infotainment and lack of physical controls has the potential to kill Rivian unless something changes. There are a lot of people that don't like change, and if you want to succeed long-term, you can't just go after the tech-savvy people as that's really limiting your market. There are a lot of us that just want a no-nonsense vehicle that simply works without all the gadgetry.
I spent the weekend with a (5 year old) Tesla model S. It has the same number of physical controls as the rivian.

A lot of the people who buy cars like BMW, Range Rover, etc are not technologically literate at all. And yet, they’re all jammed to the gills with over complicated gadgets.

the r1T is downright simple compared to, say, BMW iDrive
 

Dark-Fx

Well-Known Member
First Name
Brian
Joined
Jul 15, 2020
Threads
96
Messages
9,362
Reaction score
17,762
Location
Michigan
Vehicles
Polestar 2, R1T, R1S, Livewire One, Fisker Ocean
Occupation
Engineering
Clubs
 
People complained about that phone without a keyboard too.

Change is hard, but you'll come around. Or maybe you still use a blackberry?
I still miss my blackberry keyboard. Way fewer typos.
 

Dark-Fx

Well-Known Member
First Name
Brian
Joined
Jul 15, 2020
Threads
96
Messages
9,362
Reaction score
17,762
Location
Michigan
Vehicles
Polestar 2, R1T, R1S, Livewire One, Fisker Ocean
Occupation
Engineering
Clubs
 
Because they have the only ubiquitous, reliable, and user friendly charging network, people will flock to TESLA because of that network even if their roofs and body panels keep blowing off on the way home from the damn delivery center
There are fewer Tesla superchargers than CCS. The networks just need to get their shit together and be proactive about repairs instead of delayed reactive. Especially given the chip issues right now.
 

SASSquatch

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 3, 2022
Threads
34
Messages
1,834
Reaction score
3,562
Location
Washington DC
Vehicles
BMW i3s Ford C-Max Hybrid
Occupation
Semi-Autonomous Yeti
Clubs
 
There are fewer Tesla superchargers than CCS. The networks just need to get their shit together and be proactive about repairs instead of delayed reactive. Especially given the chip issues right now.
I hear you. They outnumber TESLA, and they are going to continue to outnumber TESLA over time - but they are just really 🤬 'ing painful to use, confusing, all over the place on charging speed, and broken too much of the time.

Biden has the right idea by forcing any manufacturers who want subsidies from the 500,000 charger initiative to require that you do NOT need an app, the machine will take a credit card, and the experience is like pumping gas. Swipe/Charge.
Sponsored

 
 




Top